interesting hand - KK vs AA..

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interesting hand - KK vs AA..

Postby retsel » Mon Apr 06, 2009 5:09 pm

got this interesting hand.. hope to hear views from kakis here..
7 handed Cash game NLHE $1/2.

i was in BB postion holding KK, got few limpers along the way until SB raises to $12. ( the $12 raise is quite a norm for that session), i smooth called as i wanted to check how many limpers behind will call the raise... and only 1 in late postion (LP) called.. 3 way..

flop 2,8,Q rainbow.. SB bet $20.. me and LP called...

turn Q.. SB check.. i bet $50(stack still have around $75 after the $50 bet)... LP fold.. SB(stack is deep, around $400-500) was put in tank for a while.. he folded in the end.. he requested to see my cards.. i flip over my KKs.. he flip his AAs..

he told me he put me on AQ.. thus he folded his AAs.. did he play that hand wrongly?
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Re: interesting hand - KK vs AA..

Postby Nicefingers » Mon Apr 06, 2009 5:30 pm

not really, the line you took luckily represented the trip queens.

You didn't reraise pre, he doesn't put you on that strong of a hand like KK. 2 callers on the flop after he led out. Someone must have a Queen bec its a rainbow board with no draws. Your led out after the turn strongly indicates a strong hand because you pot committed yourself. What are the hands that will do that? FH, Trip Queens.

So his fold is not that bad. You just didn't play your hand faced up. I'm sure if you re raise pre, he won't fold to you on the turn like this.
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Re: interesting hand - KK vs AA..

Postby juice14 » Mon Apr 06, 2009 5:41 pm

I think SB bet way too little into the pot: Based on Limpers plus PF raise, Pot should have at least 40++. By betting $20 he's enticing you to come in.... then he gets scared on the Q.

If anything he should continue firing (I would) or shove on flop to take it down there, by checking he is giving up initiative.... of course being in SB is the worst possible place to be.

..... psst then again I'm a poker donkey sometimes heheh... so my opinion is not necessarily correct, better ask Daniel Negreanu :)
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Re: interesting hand - KK vs AA..

Postby felixleong » Mon Apr 06, 2009 9:05 pm

you played too passively, should had re-raise preflop as a default play at least 80% time. Only sometimes flat call pre against overly aggressive players ba~ would be much better

SB turn fold very marginal, at a very loose table calling 1 more bet at the turn to see if river can be checked down or not is fine. With a good read or against a tight player, folding the turn to a suspected trips Q is fine.
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Re: interesting hand - KK vs AA..

Postby SGluckbox » Tue Apr 07, 2009 12:59 am

He did not play his hand wrongly in my opinion. Several factors probably made him decide to fold his hand on the turn:

First of all, the flop action went bet call call, you were calling with one more person to act behind you, which indicates a strong made hand. You could be on a draw, but on that dry flop, your range is weighted more towards made hands than draws. The overcall from the dick behind you could mean that he either had a Q as well, or was on a draw, or maybe even mid pair if that guy is bad enough.

Secondly, the deciding factor that made him fold his WA/WB hand was prolly your turn action. You decided to fire at the pot with one guy left to act behind you when the board paired the Q. He couldn't have imagined that his AA hand was ever good in that spot. I think your decision to bet on the turn was good, although I'm not sure if you did that because you felt your hand was good and decided to valuebet, or if you decided that you could fold out hands that beat you like AA. Hands with a Q obviously wont be folding so if you decided to valuebet on the turn with your KK, its probably marginal since its unlikely that you will ever be called by worse hands, unless you have a bluffy image.

Oh ya, 3rd factor, he's out of position, he has commited relatively little chips after the flop, and it is highly likely that if he calls your turn bet, he will be facing a river bet, and I did not think he wanted to play a huge pot with that hand. If you had reraised on preflop, I don't think he is ever folding his AA on that board.
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Re: interesting hand - KK vs AA..

Postby retsel » Tue Apr 07, 2009 11:53 am

ya.. i think things will be different if i reraise SB pre-flop.. we could ended up shoving preflop..
sadly my friend is no longer talking to me now.. he say i used to give him bad beats.. and now i making him fold the best hands..
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