Anyone feels that i'm a fish? Or am I just too cautious?

Discuss ring game approaches and strategies here

Anyone feels that i'm a fish? Or am I just too cautious?

Postby jonasjive » Tue Feb 23, 2010 1:48 am

Hi guys,

Just needed to get opinions from kakis here is this is a fish play by me??? :lol:

Live Game Stakes 2/2 10 handed

Dealt to me (BB) [5h] [7c]

7 players limp in.... Pot of $14

Flop

[3d] [4s] [6d]

I bet out $5

1 villian in mid position min raise to $10

Button (loose aggresive player who have been calling me and any player with almost any pair) re-raise to 75.

Mid position villian stack and Button stack covers mine.

My stack was $425.

What would u do if u were me? ;)

Will tell u guys what I did later on :?
jonasjive
Challenge Poker Player
 
Posts: 208
Joined: Tue Apr 21, 2009 1:17 am

Re: Anyone feels that i'm a fish? Or am I just too cautious?

Postby DM101 » Tue Feb 23, 2010 1:52 am

RAISY DAISY!!! ;)
User avatar
DM101
Site Admin
 
Posts: 2307
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2007 11:52 am
Medals: 16
Long Jie Participant (1) Genting Poker Tournament (5) Macau Cup Participant (1) APPT Participant (1) EPT Participant (1) 2nd Place in a poker tourny (1) 1000 posts (1) Article Contributor (1) Reporter - Bringer of news (1)
Chatterbox - Bigga Mouth~ (1) Helpful Kaki (1) Good Seller (1)

Re: Anyone feels that i'm a fish? Or am I just too cautious?

Postby RedHorse » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:01 am

All-in since u have the nuts!
RedHorse
New Fish
 
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Oct 29, 2009 4:12 pm

Re: Anyone feels that i'm a fish? Or am I just too cautious?

Postby Vinally » Tue Feb 23, 2010 12:00 pm

If u scare, go all in.

If you brave, slowplay with risk. Just raise double of whatever he bet, but care for full house.

heh.
Vinally
Challenge Poker Player
 
Posts: 134
Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:51 pm

Pokerkaki Ads

Postby Pokerkaki Ads

Pokerkaki Ads
Shameless Advertising to keep this site alive

Re: Anyone feels that i'm a fish? Or am I just too cautious?

Postby jonasjive » Tue Feb 23, 2010 12:24 pm

Yup,

all of you are correct!

With the tension mounting in that had with such a big re-raise, I went ALL - IN....

Mid position villian FOLD
Button position villian think for damn long...... and FOLD... shows me [2s] [5d] :roll:

Now, I think bout it, Chris, you are correct... I should just do a raise.. with my stack of 425, probably a raise of 100 to 125 would be good enough for Mid position villian to FOLD and Suck out the button.... And can go ALL - IN on the turn... ;)
jonasjive
Challenge Poker Player
 
Posts: 208
Joined: Tue Apr 21, 2009 1:17 am

Re: Anyone feels that i'm a fish? Or am I just too cautious?

Postby chenghao » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:41 pm

u had the stone cold nuts on a rainbow flop , nothing beats you wor
User avatar
chenghao
Great White Shark
 
Posts: 855
Joined: Tue May 26, 2009 10:21 pm
Medals: 3
Chatterbox - Bigga Mouth~ (1) Helpful Kaki (1) Good Seller (1)

Re: Anyone feels that i'm a fish? Or am I just too cautious?

Postby Vinally » Tue Feb 23, 2010 4:37 pm

lol. what if he got full house?

33, then turn/river 4 or 6. GGed.

heh.

But if i were you, i sure go re-raise and all in. :)
Vinally
Challenge Poker Player
 
Posts: 134
Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:51 pm

Re: Anyone feels that i'm a fish? Or am I just too cautious?

Postby jonasjive » Wed Feb 24, 2010 12:38 am

Bro chenghao,

its not a rainbow flop... thats what makes it tricky...

how i wish it was a rainbow flop lor... ;p
jonasjive
Challenge Poker Player
 
Posts: 208
Joined: Tue Apr 21, 2009 1:17 am

Re: Anyone feels that i'm a fish? Or am I just too cautious?

Postby Mydral » Wed Feb 24, 2010 6:15 am

Honest opinion and I hope you grow from it as a player... you completly misplayed it.

5$ into 14$ is the first mistake (in your case its a mistake since your thinking of re-raising all-in, so it shows your thought pattern). It does not protect vs draws and its way too little. Bet 10$ minimum here.. you want money and you want a polarized range. Betting small here is readable.

As played.. do not even think of going all-in on the turn... everyone will fold except if they hold like a set or something. You do not want this. The correct option is just a call.... noone has a freaking draw here. Min-raise = pair (duh!!), re-raise = something stronger then a pair. So just call... what are you afraid off? Full-house?? sigh..

Oh and check the turn, agro fish will go all-in by himself.

Look if you want to make money in Poker its about maximizing value, that means winning the maximum and loosing the minimum. Winning the minimum is not part of that equation...
Mydral
New Fish
 
Posts: 49
Joined: Fri Sep 18, 2009 8:34 am

Re: Anyone feels that i'm a fish? Or am I just too cautious?

Postby chenghao » Wed Feb 24, 2010 12:36 pm

depends on whether you want to win the whole stack of your opponents or u wanna win just the pot i guess.
how have u been playing before that ? snug ? maniac ? what would an All in represent to your opponent ? a bluff ? trying to extract maximum ? a marginal hand ?
what are the tendencies of your opponent in his position ? does he like to limp with suited cards like K2s , A4s etc? does he limp with Pocket pairs hoping hit a set or does he raise with any pocket pair hoping it will be over pairs on flop/ hits a set ?

given no understanding of your opponent ,
if u flat the flop ,there would be $ 174 in the pot. 348 left in your stack , more then 348 in vllian's stack.
On the turn
any diamonds (9/47 times ) or 3/4/6 would make you tank also (on the condition if he does hold a set/ two pair 7/47 times)
a blank would give you chance to extract more (47-16)/47 = 31
so 34 % of the time he would improve his hand , 66% he doesn't.
when the blank falls , you are OOP with the nuts , you definately wanna bet here so that by the river , u can stack the villian.
betting anywhere from 1/2 to pot size would give your opponent in correct odds to draw in the long run and build up the pot to such a size that shipping it on the river is inevitable.

if you min raise(another $75) the flop and got called , there would be $324 in the post and $198 left in your stack , more then $198 in the villian's stack ,
it would be much a easier decision to ship it on the turn.

On the river
if a blank comes on the river , any diamonds (9/46 times) or (3/4/6 / pair the blank) would make you tank (on the condition if he does hold a set/ dubs 10/47 times)
a blank would give you chance to extract more only if he called with a hand like TPTK , TPGK , 2 pairs , set and he thinks his good , draws would give up if u shoved Out of position.
User avatar
chenghao
Great White Shark
 
Posts: 855
Joined: Tue May 26, 2009 10:21 pm
Medals: 3
Chatterbox - Bigga Mouth~ (1) Helpful Kaki (1) Good Seller (1)

Re: Anyone feels that i'm a fish? Or am I just too cautious?

Postby Lurker » Sun May 01, 2011 10:11 am

$1/$2 live game with 5 7 unsuited i dont see how you want to rise to $10 unless you trying to put up a show...if every non connectors and unsuited low cards you want to call $10 then you are the fish, you be wasting alot of bullets for nothing.

what you did is no wrong...maybe you expect the aggressive player to call you...but sometimes is about the magic number...it might be too big too call since you all in 400...200 should be a good number for him to call...

if you slow play there is always a risk of him improving his cards but if you call hard there is a chance you might win lesser. sometimes you need to weight winning more VS winning less. to me sometimes you kill off the competition and win less is better then you slow play then he improve and turn back to haunt you.

given the nuts hand here...you should slow play abit then see if there is any chances of better cards before all in later or check then all in. but if you smell a flush but cant let go of your striaght then i suggest you just all in from the start to prevent you from such headaches
Lurker
New Fish
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Sat Apr 30, 2011 10:36 am

Re: Anyone feels that i'm a fish? Or am I just too cautious?

Postby xcaliblur » Mon May 02, 2011 1:59 am

Lurker, what Mydral meant was raising on the flop, not pre-flop.

No complaints against pre-flop play by me.. not much of a choice seeing that 7 people limped and youre BB with 57os.

However, i disagree with slowplaying there. I also think betting about $8-10 is a fine amount, but then again this all depends on your betting history. Its best to keep your betting consistent on bluffs and when you have monsters. Why i dont like slowplaying in this instance
1. There ARE draws on the board. 2 diamonds on the flop and a coordinated board in a 7 limp pot is quite dangerous to slowplay. If say you call, most likely MP will call as well ,and if the board pairs or a diamond comes, youll be in early position not knowing if you are still best or not. If neither comes but a 5, 2 or 7 drops that will put 4 to a straight on the board, and will likely kill the action, or cause a split pot between you and someone else. Remember that pot is 7 ppl limped preflop, is it not possible that someone flopped a flush draw, 2 pair, set or open ended straight draw and raised you with any of these combinations?

2. There already was a raise and re-raise AFTER your bet. Not much point slowplaying there. Theres a fair chance that one person will all your all in, and that is what you are hoping for with a flopped straight. I find it hard to believe that soemone would limp in with 25os (thrashy hand) and then fold the second nuts on the flop to a reraise. What is the point of limping preflop if you are going to flop a straight with these kind of hands then muck them on the flop?

3. Going all in also serves to protect your table image. You obviously will not re-raise with air in that spot, and if you are also not going to re-raise with a made hand, then people will eventually pick up on it and keep raising you in position, knowing that they will either only get a call or a fold. Doing this sends a message across so that next time, when you DO bet, people will have to think carefully before raising you.

just my 2 cents
xcaliblur
Challenge Poker Player
 
Posts: 100
Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2009 10:51 pm

Re: Anyone feels that i'm a fish? Or am I just too cautious?

Postby slkia » Mon May 02, 2011 3:44 am

the answer is stack size and bet sizing

will u want draws to call? yes
will u want sets to call? yes
will u want over pairs to call? yes

wats the probability of being out drawn on turn

against a str draw, 0
against a flush draw, 18%
against a set, 10%
against over pair, 0

raise to 185, leaving 240 behind, shove 240 on the turn regardless.
will flush draw call both street? yes
will set call both street? yes

pot on turn = 185+185+10+14 = 394

wats the probability u are shoving 240 on turn when u are behind?

abt 28%...

assume draws and sets will always call u as it is +ev for them to call with ur bet size, u are risking 240 to win 614, do u tink it is +ev?

y not all in? cause u chase draws away
y not flat call? cause u r oop and u will give the draw a free card
slkia
Challenge Poker Player
 
Posts: 107
Joined: Wed Nov 26, 2008 8:40 pm
Medals: 8
Long Jie Participant (2) Genting Poker Tournament (2) Macau Cup Participant (1) APPT Participant (1) Chatterbox - Bigga Mouth~ (1) Helpful Kaki (1)

Pokerkaki Ads

Postby Pokerkaki Ads

Pokerkaki Ads
Shameless Advertising to keep this site alive

Re: Anyone feels that i'm a fish? Or am I just too cautious?

Postby xanleo » Mon May 02, 2011 10:40 am

hey dude, i believe flat calling there will not give you any further value unless the villian actually outdraws you and hit his fullhouse ? He'd probably throw his hand instantly either when u flat or raise him if a blank turned up in the turn.
xanleo
New Fish
 
Posts: 40
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2010 5:16 pm

Next

Return to Cash Games

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests

 

Recent Posts

Subscribe to RSS headline updates from:
Powered by FeedBurner

Site

Subscribe to RSS headline updates from:
Powered by FeedBurner