Kings vs 72

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Kings vs 72

Postby Qingkun » Wed Mar 09, 2011 7:48 pm

I went to this 1/1 game today and lose $438 in this $900 pot.

my stack was $438 and i'm in big blind position looking down at pocket king
2 of the mid position call $1
button rise to $8 with $600 or $700 behide
small blind call $8
I rise it to $48 on top coz the player on the button is kind of a loose aggressive player

2 mid position fold
botton call without thinking very long
small blind fold

pot now is $106

flop call QC 7H 7D

I check and the button bet out around $55
I rise it to $205
without thinking he went all in and i call

he show his 7C 2S and we run it one time but i nv hit....
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Re: Kings vs 72

Postby chenghao » Wed Mar 09, 2011 8:13 pm

what the LAG is probably doing is stealing opening from the button, so when you 3b Preflop again , you signal that you have a strong hand.

So his plan changed from taking the blinds down uncontested to fit or fold e.g. make 2 pair or better on the Flop to try to take your whole stack.

By raising this dry flop , you are doing a thin bet as the range that will give you action in that situation is very small
(why is it dry ? paired board , uncoordinated , rainbow vs wet board : coordinated board like TJQ , 789 , 2 or 3 of the same suit dd , hh , ss , cc , DDD etc )

the bottom of the range would be QX , top of the range would be FH, A7s , etc.

would be advisable to check call the F with the intention to call him down depending on any reads you had of him (e.g. once and done , known to 3 barrels with air)
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Re: Kings vs 72

Postby Qingkun » Wed Mar 09, 2011 8:42 pm

I wanted the pot there at the flop so i did a check raise there and put in more then half of my stack. What would u do if u have pot in $263 and he put u all in with 180+ on top.... Pot is $516 and i think is kind of hard for me to let go of my hand coz no matter wad i still will have 2 outs if he have the 7 or pocket Q's
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Re: Kings vs 72

Postby donzo » Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:02 pm

if i may just give my two cents worth, when we count our outs of improving our hands, we also need to bear in mind the outs of drawing dead..

the all-in should have made you think twice about the strength of your kings..
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Re: Kings vs 72

Postby chenghao » Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:16 pm

Qingkun wrote:I wanted the pot there at the flop so i did a check raise there and put in more then half of my stack. What would u do if u have pot in $263 and he put u all in with 180+ on top.... Pot is $516 and i think is kind of hard for me to let go of my hand coz no matter wad i still will have 2 outs if he have the 7 or pocket Q's


thats why you call and not raise the Flop , then decide the Turn

c/r is silly there as bluffs would fold there , better hands would push it

you want the bluffs to continue bluffing and better hands to earn less.

as for the marginal hands (QX , 88 - JJ) , well , my strategy isn't to earn the max from these spots , so it really differs from person to person how their overall strategy is . Then these spots should be changed according to the factors
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Re: Kings vs 72

Postby Qingkun » Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:21 pm

I would like to share this other play that i have make few months back and i still can't think of how does this guy call

2/2 game
my stack was $1250 odd and i''m at cut off position looking down at 9d Jd
2 player from mid position call $2
i call $2
button rise it to $15 with $2100 odd behind
small blind fold
big blind fold
2 mid position call
i call also
pot now is $60

flop came 2c 10d Qc
2 mid postition check
i bet out $45 with an open hand
button call
both of the mid postion fold
pot is $150

2c 10d Qc turn an Ad

I check to the button and the button bet out $115
I raise it to $260 total
He re-raise me $300 on top
and i when all in with $640 on top of it (i was trying to do a semi bluff with my monster draw)
he think for around 2 to 3 mins and he say call

he turn his card over and it was As 3h
i really dunno how he make that call there when that r so many hand that can win help and he could also be drawing dead

the best part was we run 3 time and i miss it all

story of my fucking life
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Re: Kings vs 72

Postby chenghao » Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:50 pm

Qingkun wrote:I would like to share this other play that i have make few months back and i still can't think of how does this guy call

2/2 game
my stack was $1250 odd and i''m at cut off position looking down at 9d Jd
2 player from mid position call $2
i call $2
button rise it to $15 with $2100 odd behind
small blind fold
big blind fold
2 mid position call
i call also
pot now is $60

flop came 2c 10d Qc
2 mid postition check
i bet out $45 with an open hand (open ended straight draw)
button call
both of the mid postion fold
pot is $150

2c 10d Qc turn an Ad

I check to the button and the button bet out $115
I raise it to $260 total
He re-raise me $300 on top
and i when all in with $640 on top of it (i was trying to do a semi bluff with my monster draw)
he think for around 2 to 3 mins and he say call

he turn his card over and it was As 3h
i really dunno how he make that call there when that r so many hand that can win help and he could also be drawing dead

the best part was we run 3 time and i miss it all

story of my fucking life


do what we call a preflop pump or dump
either you raise , or you fold , calling is icky and makes it hard to play.

On the flop , while you do have an Open ender , there is a higher open ender out there ( KJ drawing 9 and A) , he hitting the A then you hitting the 8 would spell disaster.

the Flop is quite wet , QT2c , there are both flush draw and straight draws out there . Has he seen you lead ( you betting into the preflop raiser) the flop before ? how strong does he think you are when you do so ?

On the Flop , when you lead into him and he calls , his purpose is probably to peel an Ace , but what does he put you on ? Lets say you can lead with straight draw , flush draw , or TP

On the Turn , he loses only to the straight draw that completes

would you lead with a straight draw and then check when your draw hits ?

of course shouldn't discount sets / 2 pairs here , but generally he peels rather light. easy to extract value from . difficult to semi bluff , so don't semi bluff him , just bet for value and draw if its cheap
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Re: Kings vs 72

Postby Vinally » Thu Mar 10, 2011 11:41 am

Qingkun, the best is to stick to 100bb to 200bb. do not play so overdeep stack, like 600bb for 1/1. and 2/2, almost 500bb. dont put all into one basket.

i think i wont comment on your game, about same as chenghao already point them out. heh.
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Re: Kings vs 72

Postby mvp_user » Thu Mar 10, 2011 1:05 pm

it's easy to come up with theories once the hands are flipped open . KK vs 72 in this case is just a scenario of a bad beat . Even check calling the flop , turn and river would eventually lead to u losing ur whole stack . Check calling would induce more barrels or stacking the Villain off if he indeed has QX . However with every poker play comes with pros and cons , check calling the flop after 3 betting pre is a really strong line and if the villain is an experienced player enough he'd shut down if he had QX or even 7X as u could easily have QQ full in that spot . Raising on the flop would be the best choice as since the stacks were pretty deep , raising there would get the villain more committed and even stack him off with AQ in that spot a high % of the time . Thus really no right or wrong way to play this hand really . i'd assume that the villain in this case has confidence that he can outplay u or even put u on a range of hands , from AQ being the worst to AK , QQ ,KK , AA in ascending order.
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Re: Kings vs 72

Postby chenghao » Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:02 pm

mvp_user wrote:it's easy to come up with theories once the hands are flipped open . KK vs 72 in this case is just a scenario of a bad beat . Even check calling the flop , turn and river would eventually lead to u losing ur whole stack . Check calling would induce more barrels or stacking the Villain off if he indeed has QX . However with every poker play comes with pros and cons , check calling the flop after 3 betting pre is a really strong line and if the villain is an experienced player enough he'd shut down if he had QX or even 7X as u could easily have QQ full in that spot . Raising on the flop would be the best choice as since the stacks were pretty deep , raising there would get the villain more committed and even stack him off with AQ in that spot a high % of the time . Thus really no right or wrong way to play this hand really . i'd assume that the villain in this case has confidence that he can outplay u or even put u on a range of hands , from AQ being the worst to AK , QQ ,KK , AA in ascending order.


if you a read on a player who would play a Qx on a dry board IP this way when checked to , by all means raise to get value from him. However in most cases , you would be crushed by the hand that calls your check/raise/shove line. Of course i might be wrong and those LAG regulars disagree with me , but i am a nit at heart. So what i said is my way to play
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